Canvas or Nylon

[tplife]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

My Kodiak weights 68 lbs total. 6.5 pounds in stakes, probably close to 40 pounds of tent and 20 pounds of poles. The last 2 weights are a guess as I am not sure of there exact weight. A quick look on the web shows that a 10 x 10 cabin or family type tent weights around 30 pounds. I found some cheaper tents and some 10 x 14 tents that weight close to 40 pounds. Of course this is with the poles which you could also break out of this package if you wanted. The point I was trying to make is people complain about the weight of the canvas tents but then carry around a 30 pound nylon tent. Well I would rather pack around my 68 pound canvas tent in two pieces then a nylon tent. I think my steel grill for my camp chef weights more then my tent.

No idea what kind of tents you were getting your weights from, but my top-line 6-man tent weighs around 24 pounds, (Sierra Designs, Big Agnes, NorthFace, Mountain HardWear, Marmot, etc.) about 1/2 the weight of a similar canvas tent. I've spent a few hours with the campground owner picking canvas tents out of the trees, after tropical storm winds rolled through, and my experience has led me to wind-shedding polyester/nylon designs using anodized aluminum poles made to take light snow loads and high winds (we camp in mountains and desert so been there, done that) with lots of vertical space and 6-pole designs, so I don't need to watch short videos trying to get at my wallet. My workhorse tents are dual-wall and their zippers are covered with full vestibules that can shelter additional gear outside from the weather. A Kodiak is a FINE HIGH-END canvas tent, but I neither want it's old-school design nor it's heavy weight. Plenty of outfitters do use polyester tents for high-altitude treks, both canvas and poly have their place and their advantages. The bulk of a big Kodiak will be an issue as well for me, since all the gear my photos show are carried in my '00 Acura Integra, 30 mpg. As long as it's YOU and not me carrying that 68-pound tent around, I'm a happy camper!

[muddydogs]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

Thats fine we all like what we like but you also put out bad information in your posts. You basically claim that these tents won't work in the desert due to winds or mountains due to driving rain but then again you also claim that the 9mm is a ok caliber for bear and that a 223 will handle big game. I am not in to the Burning Man deal but any search about springbar tents will show some results from people posting about how well there tents help up to the winds and dust in the Nevada desert. I looked at comparable tents to the 10x10 Kodiak, not sure what size the tent is you referred to or how tall the tent is and I don't care to look right now as I am happy with my Kodiak.

You might ask why I think I know so much about tents and camping, well 20 years working in the woods throughout the West has taught me a lot. I have truck camped, backpacked, and hiked in most of the National Forests, National Parks, State Forests, Indian Reservations and Federal Lands this side of the Continental Divide and a few on the other side of the big hill to boot. I will admit that I have almost never (drove through a chunk going from Nevada to Arizona) set foot in California so maybe things are way different there.

[tplife]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

That's cool muddydogs. I grew up in the wilderness, started tent camping in 1960 (babies camp too ya' know), backpacking in 1974 and hunt black bear and mulies out here in D7 and my match-grade ARs make BIG exit holes, and are still in use by the US military. And amazingly, they work for me. Most of our shots are around 100 yards or less, so the velocity of the load makes up for its lower mass - this arguement is almost as old as rifles themselves and the gun shop shelves offer a variety of high-power loads. I am glad you hare happy with your Kodiak, but my experience is they don't work for everyone, and I've long since moved on from my old funky-smelling canvas tents to polyester due to those drawbacks. Assuming they will shed rain and wind as well as my Sierra Designs models, I still don't like the design, weight, etc. I like them in seasonal settings where the campsite is likely to be up for a month or more without the need for taking down - a use I don't have for them. There are several other users of Kodiak and Springbar tents on this website who only have good things to say about them, and I say more power to them. I don't need or want a 68-pound canvas monstrosity or a giantic Camp Chef Grill, but I camp and hunt with folks who use them and we're still friends. :cool:

[shawnbebout]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

I would like to know what the OP (Mike Burke) spent his money on.

FYI: This winter I plan to add a gigantic Camp Chef Grill to my setup!!!!

[tplife]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

I would like to know what the OP (Mike Burke) spent his money on.

FYI: This winter I plan to add a gigantic Camp Chef Grill to my setup!!!!

If he's laying out around $450 for a tent, you'd think he'd have a whole lot more choices other then 2...BTW, I already have a "Camp Chef", the smaller import model, wears a size zero dress... :cool:

[gear_junkie]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

I don't need or want a 68-pound canvas monstrosity

You keep making this sound MUCH bigger and more complicated than it is. Don't know when you gave up on your canvas tent, but the new Kodiak Flex-bows are far from monstrosities - more like luxury accomodations.

I camp in a small Honda Civic and the Flex fits in the trunk quite nicely. Since it's in two pieces, it's easy to carry. Also, 68 pounds isn't very heavy: an olympic bar at the gym with 10-pounder on each side. Big deal. Don't overlook the benefit of not needing guylines.

I haven't used my tent in high winds yet, but there are tons of reviews on Cabela's web site that attest to how well it stands up to heavy winds.

As a former high-end tent user (North Face, LL Bean), I can tell you you that the Kodiak is THE BEST tent I've ever slept in. Most comfortable, easiest set up, best interior layout, etc...

[ecichlid]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

In order to figure out who is "right" here, we are going to have to arm wrestle.

[tplife]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

No need for wrestling, we camp in different environments and adapt to what works best for each. The last canvas tent was the same 3-pole design as the Kodiak, it got smashed up in a NJ nor-easter while unattended. The 44-pounds of weight we save in our Acura Integra (same as a Civic) gives us room for our Optima deep-discharge battery and 200W Kenwood/Polk stereo setup, I like having music and power along with me. We camp in what are sometimes extreme conditions. Our fall camping includes sub-zero nights, the water systems can freeze up and it's not until 11 that anything flows. There are light snow loads, not a big deal as our snows are very fluffy and dry, not like the back-east winters of my youth. The winter desert trips seem pleasant, but now and then a blow comes up that strips the desert floor bare, and you never come back without goggles. Here is a short video, the first has the low-profile 4-man SD Base Camp tethered to the Acura. My 10 year old daughter is still fast asleep inside. The other video shows activity in-camp during the blow... :eek:

[shawnbebout]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

If you tied your canvas tent off to your car, it wouldn't of blown away either. Regardless of which tent you have, those video's don't look fun to me. I know those are rare occasions, but getting sand blasted would suck!!!!

[tplife]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

You're right shawn, but if I had a canvas tent, it wouldn't have fit in my car! Another reason I don't own them (until I get a Suburban anyway). My daughter slept right through it. Actually those videos were fun as you can see by people walking around with beers in hand, and it's not a rare occasion in the local desert. We try to come prepared!

[muddydogs]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

Ya I don't do extreme conditions.


This was a few years ago and the tents were Eureka A frames. We got all that snow during the night and wouldn't you know it the old Chevy wouldn't start. After about 2 days of being stranded a couple good old boys from Missouri happened by and got me pull started. I don't think its different conditions that we camp in I think its just different camping. I prefer to have a 4x4 rig and pull my 5 x 10 trailer with my camping gear. We rarely stay in camp sites and I like to have my big tent, stove, table, dutch ovens and tricked out camping boxes. I can and have gone the minimalist route but anymore I like my stuff. I can still put up a camp and tear it down in 45 minutes if needed so I am still Mobile.



It got a little wet on this one, the road was a mess coming out. took me an 2 hours once we got home to clean the mud off the boats and trailer.



Here is the bad little KIA Sorento. Not what most would expect a truck guy like me to be driving but its got a lot less miles and rattles then the old Suburban. I need a new truck.

[tplife]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

Nice setup! Looks like the wet snow back home in 'Jersey too. I like the trailer and setup Muddydogs, the kitchen sink! We don't like the minimalist approach either, so have upgraded our gear over time to that which is the most efficient, lightest, and takes up the least space. Gives us room for the fun stuff, like the 200W camp stereo and OPTIMA D34M marine battery - handy if the car battery dies!

[Deathss]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

Nice setup! Looks like the wet snow back home in 'Jersey too. I like the trailer and setup Muddydogs, the kitchen sink! We don't like the minimalist approach either, so have upgraded our gear over time to that which is the most efficient, lightest, and takes up the least space. Gives us room for the fun stuff, like the 200W camp stereo and OPTIMA D34M marine battery - handy if the car battery dies!

I am not trying to offend you, so don't take it the wrong way. I chuckled reading how you upgraded gear to be light, but you take along a Deep cell battery for tunes?!?!?! How about just rolling down the windows on your car and listening to the stereo in there?
I also recommend canvas tents because they are environmentally friendly. They are made from Cotton or Hemp, which are naturally renewable fibers.

[busere]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

I see a lot of conversation about weight being a factor...I'm in the military, and dealing with tents that you need a pallet-jack or a forklift to move to the set-up sight and 12-14 people to set them up, 68 pounds sounds great to me!!!!! :cool:

[Deathss]

Re: Canvas or Nylon

The older we get, the heavier things become!