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  • Family Tent Conundrum

    Hullo all! Even though we are currently in the throes of winter and are enjoying the fruits of our first big winter storm (got just over a foot of snow, and it is currently about 6 below zero out there), my mind is wandering to milder weather and CAMPING!!! So, as a brief review, our biggest family tent got damaged last season in a tornado when camping in Maine. It was an el-cheapo Ozark Trail that we got a good 6 years out of, so I'm fine with just letting it go and not trying to fix it. Hubby has just given me clearance to replace the tent (happy dance! I love new tents!!), so I have been weighing the options. I don't really want another el-cheapo, would like to invest in a nice, solid tent that our family can enjoy for years to come.

    Here's the specifics: Family of four, myself, hubby (who is 6'6") and two kids ages 5 and 9 (who have Daddy's height, my 9 yo is almost as tall as me!). I prefer the structural integrity of a dome or tunnel tent, but generally can't get the head clearance to accommodate hubby with most models I've seen. I want a square/rectangle shape, no tapered ends or funny shapes. Straighter walls are preferred to avoid wasted, unusable space. Although I am tempted by the canvas tents, packed size and weight are a slight concern of mine. Our last cabin tent was a 12'x16' with almost an 8' ceiling, and seemed to be a pretty good size to give space for everything and room to move around/get dressed/etc. I'm sure there is more, but that's the basics.

    I have exhaustively researched the tents out there, the REI Kingdom 8 and Big Agnes Flying Diamond 8 are the frontrunners at the moment, but my absolute dream tent is an Outwell from the UK. I have recently discovered a way to get an Outwell shipped reasonably to the US, so I am seriously tempted to finally take the plunge on my bucket list tent. For about the same price as the Big Agnes, I can get the tent of my dreams. I am torn because although Outwell get incredible reviews, I will not be able to see it in person before taking the plunge.

    Thoughts? Other things I might not have considered? Help me decide please! Thanks!
    Married to Longpants, Mom to Littlepants (9) and Tinypants (5). Love Camping in New England!

  • #2
    Re: Family Tent Conundrum

    Hey Shortpants! These are fun dilemmas.... :happy:

    My thoughts....and excluding canvas.

    The Big Agnes Flying Diamond is an excellent tent (strong pole structure, weather worthy, large vestibule, lots of vents, good fabrics/quality manufacturing). But...not sure it would be best in your situation: peak height height in the larger dome room is only 6ft...the smaller dome is only 44 inches. You may also find the footprint size smaller than you're accustomed to...it's 10 x 9 ish in large room (you don't get a 9++ foot width along the whole side-only at the side bumpouts), 4'4'' x 7' in the small dome. Additionally, the "duck in" height to enter the main tent is somewhat lower still due to the vestibule. This tent may also be warmer in the mugginess of summer as the inner tent body as less mesh than I would consider normal for a summer style tent. Of course this is a trade-off / compromise to allow it to also be used in more harsh conditions.

    Big Agnes Flying Diamond dimensions:

    Click image for larger version

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    The REI Kingdom 8 is also an excellent tent. Less severe weather worthy than the Big Agnes (I wouldn't take it out in cold temps-because of the draftiness-or snow due to the pole structure), but properly staked/guyed, the K8 will handle 3 season duties with ease. Excellent ventilation owing to large amounts of mesh and a fly that can be pulled back multiple ways to increase air flow. Good sized vestibule with the ability to really increase space with the optional "garage". The K8 has a 6'5" peak height...and this runs from front to back of the entire tent. Nice rectangular footprint 12' x 8'4" of fully usable space (owing to the more vertical walls a tunnel style tent provides).

    Link to REI's Kingdom 8: https://www.rei.com/product/894017/r...kingdom-8-tent

    If you didn't go and throw out the Outwell tent idea....I would have suggested you go with the Kingdom 8. But......

    I know nothing about Outwell beyond what I've seen on YouTube videos. What model were you looking at? I am not sure I would go with the inflatable tube structure models (personal opinion). But they all use the tunnel style design (like the REI).

    If you can find one in the budget..and it's a bucket item...and it will serve you for years....sure, why not? You'll also draw lots of attention in campgrounds as it is not a tent normally seen here (I have never seen one). It's certainly not going to be a POS tent not worthy of your $$$. It may have some odd or different set-ups and/or features. Overall...the Outwell specs seem very good and it appears many campers in the UK and Australia use these and/or very similar styles from different manufacturer's with no problem. Even Coleman's UK tents appear to be more upscale/styled differently in those markets as compared to here in USA. You may want to find out how customer service is handled here in US however.
    2020: 7 nights 2019: 5 nights 2018: 20 nights 2017: 19 nights 2016: 20 nights
    Spring->Fall: Marmots: Limestone 6P and 4P, Stormlight 3P, Tungsten 3P; SlumberJack Trail Tent 6P, BA Yahmonite 5P
    Fall->Spring: Cabelas Instinct Alaskan Guide 8P, Field & Stream Cloudpeak 4P, Eastern Mountain Products Torrent 3P
    Every season: Kelty Noah's Tarps- 20, 16, 12; REI Camp Tarp 16; BA Three Forks Shelter

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    • #3
      Re: Family Tent Conundrum

      Hey a65hoosier! Thank you for the in depth and informational reply.

      You have confirmed my concerns about the Flying Diamond 8. Hubby is still not a 100% camping convert, so comfort for him is a paramount issue. If he has to stoop to get in to a tent or get dressed on his knees, he will not be a happy camper (pun intended). I also didn't like the odd shape of the tent, we currently use 2 queen mattresses, and with weird shapes they just don't fit and there is wasted space, meh. I do want to invest in a set of the Disc-O-Beds for the girls at some point, which would really help with the floor space, but that might be a hard sell at the same time as a new tent.

      The Kingdom 8 has definitely been the best option I've found that is available in the US. I really love dome tents, but they just don't fit our family, so a tunnel style seems like the next best option. Although I still had concerns of not enough space, we use every square inch of the old 12'x16', so dropping to a 12'x8'4" seems like it could be very cramped with us, beds, gear, and I have taken to storing our non-perishable food bins in the tent now so I don't have to lug them back and forth from the car every morning and night.

      I wouldn't touch an "air pole" tent with a million mile pole... they just sound like trouble. haha! I'm actually really drawn to the full steel pole structure tents, I know it adds a good chunk of weight, but every single one of my tents has had a fiberglass pole failure at some point, and the aluminum poles would be destroyed by our two rambunctious girls in no time, I fear. Since we are car campers, durability outweighs lightweight.

      My love affair with Outwell tents started when I totally by accident stumbled upon the Vermont XLP (Walkthrough video). Pretty sure my main attraction to it is that it bears the name of my beloved home state. LOL! It's a lovely tent, but it's a behemoth! At 810x480 cm (26.5'x15.75') it's a tad bit of overkill, I think. :sarcastic: The features I like are the wet room/dry room/bedroom setup, the Outtex 6000 fabric (highest hydrostatic head they offer), and the complete steel frame, just to name the top 3. Realistically, we don't need THAT much room, and at just shy of $1200 for the tent alone, not including groundsheet or any extras... that will be a hard sell to the hubby.

      So then I looked at smaller options, and found the Alabama 7P (Walkthrough video). Similar to the Vermont XLP, but a little smaller and different layout. But again, at 720x460 cm (23.6'x15'), it's still a beast of a tent. Fewer "bells and whistles" like the walk in closet, towel hangers and whatnot that are in the Vermont XLP, but I'd probably use the closet for a lug-able loo and we hang towels outside anyways, no big loss. The features I like is the different bedroom setup with the hallway/back door, the Outtex 6000 fabric and full steel frame again. Another overkill tent though, probably, and at $1008 without groundsheet or extras, hubby will still balk, I'm sure.

      Given that I will have the best luck under the $1K mark, I then found the Montana 6 (Walkthrough video). Slightly different layout and is part of the Deluxe series, which drops to the Outtex 5000 fabric and is not a complete steel frame (steel for main tent and alloy for side door frame). At 600x415 cm (19.5'x13.5') it's a little more reasonable size-wise, but still pretty large. I do like the covered and enclosed side entry for muddy shoes, etc. and the two larger bedrooms layout since it would accommodate the two queen mattresses we have now and the Disc-O-Bed in the future. I also found this tent as a package deal that includes the groundsheet and a fleece carpet for the living area for only $882, the tent alone is $756, so a pretty good deal on the package.

      Since I also like having an awning over the door, I then found the Flagstaff 5 (Walkthrough video). Nice, big awning over the front door for rain coverage when entering and exiting the tent. Part of the Deluxe series again, so the Outtex 5000 fabric and not a complete steel frame (steel for main tent and Duratec fiberglass for awning and back of tent). At 520x310 cm (17'x10') it is a much more workable size for most campsites. The one larger and one smaller bedroom setup would mean investing in the Disc-O-Beds soomer rather than later since it will not accommodate our current two queens. This one is also available as a package deal with the groundsheet and fleece carpet for $762, but it is the 2017 model, the tent alone, 2018 model, is $737. Considering this is less than the going rate for the BA Flying Diamond 8, it's more tent for less money.

      Another awning option is the Denver 6 (Walkthrough video). Large awning over the front door, this one is part of the Privlege series, so the fabric drops to the Outtex 4000 and the poles are Duratec fiberglass for the whole tent. At 530x400 cm (17'x13'), it is a little wider, allowing for the two full sized bedrooms in the back and our two queens would fit. This is available with the ground sheet and fleece carpet for $668 (2017 model) or just the tent for $567.

      Lastly, there is the Whitecove 5 (Walkthrough video). Smaller awning on this one, but enough to get in and out of the tent and to cover shoes, etc. Another Privlege series, so Outtex 4000 fabric and the poles are Duratec fiberglass for the whole tent. At 630x320 cm (20'x10.5) it is leaning towards the overly large side again, and due to being narrower has the one large and one small bedrooms, so would need the bunk cots. This is available with the ground sheet and fleece carpet for $643 (2017 model) or just the tent for $529.

      So many tents... so little time! Haha! I'm just trying to weigh all the options and features vs the price point and which is the best bang for the buck. I haven't looked much smaller than these listed, so maybe I'll take a look today and see what smaller options are. The definitely seem to be a whole lot more true to actual body capacity in the UK than here, so while I would never even look at a 4 person tent sold in the US, an Outwell 4P might just fit the bill! Off to look some more! Thanks in advance for any input or opinions!
      Married to Longpants, Mom to Littlepants (9) and Tinypants (5). Love Camping in New England!

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      • #4
        Re: Family Tent Conundrum

        Hoosier makes a good point on looking into the customer service side of Outwell here in the states. Whatever you buy from them you want to make sure they can support you after the sale.

        When we car camp we rock the Kingdom 6. Which is the same width as the Kingdom 8, but 2" shorter on peak height and 30" shorter on length. With my wife and son we have TONS of room to spare. I imagine you and your family would have plenty of room in the Kingdom 8. Just make sure to get the garage add on. You can move a ton of gear outside and free up a lot of interior space. The garage zips up very completely and hugs the ground low enough that I feel as secure as if my gear were in the tent with us. Though I still move the food bins to the car at night.

        Anyways, happy hunting! I love over analyzing tent purchases!

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        • #5
          Re: Family Tent Conundrum

          I've never met anyone who actually used an Outwell, but their marketing department gets high marks from me!
          2018: Any way the wind blows; doesn't really matter to me....Too Meee....

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          • #6
            Re: Family Tent Conundrum

            I have read up extensively on the customer support end of Outwell. Since it is an overseas product, support after the sale was a concern of mine. I have seen some complaints from Outwell owners that contacting them directly is an issue. BUT, they do not sell direct to consumer, they are a dealer only product, so complaints or issues are to be handled direct with the dealer and not with Outwell. From their website:

            "Your Point of Purchase is your first stop for all product and warranty queries.

            We do not sell directly to private customers and warranty issues are to be handled by the dealer (Sales of Goods Act). We therefore kindly ask you to contact the Outwell dealer where you have bought the product. They will then be able to advise you further.
            Our resources are concentrated on helping our customers (the retailer) service their customers (the camper) to ensure stock flows smoothly and that all obligations dictated by whatever country’s consumer law that is in operation are met fairly and quickly. We are unable to work outside this structure but retailers are normally aware of their responsibilities and will endeavour to quickly resolve a problem."

            When I find complaints about trying to deal with Outwell directly, it is generally due to some fault on the side of the end buyer not trying to deal with the dealer first, or something simple like they don't have proof of purchase, which is a standard for most retailers for returns/service. I have also read that Outwell has outstanding Dealer support and works very well with authorized dealers to resolve any issues their customers have.

            The dealer I am looking to deal with gets 5 star reviews for service after the sale, and offers a 1 year warranty on anything they sell, barring the usual of issues due to customer error, acts of God, etc. Again, the only negative reviews of the dealer I have seen have been from customers that didn't have proof of purchase, had an issue after the year warranty period and expected warranty service, etc. So all in all, I feel ok not only with the product support from the manufacturer, but from the dealer as well.

            Obviously, concerns are there about ever needing replacement parts or customer support. Although parts are available from the dealer, it's not like I can pop over to my local REI and talk to them in person. The dealer I am looking at buying from is duty-free and offers free economy shipping to the US, so it's not like I would be spending hundreds in shipping just to get a replacement tent pole if I ever needed one.

            Yeah, Irate Mormon, they have the marketing nailed at Outwell, for sure!! I don't even want to guess how many hours I have spent watching their walkthrough and pitching videos, pouring over their website, and reading reviews from owners of their products. I think my poor husband is going to sprain his eyeballs from rolling them every time I watch the Vermont XLP walkthough video AGAIN!! ROFL!!
            Married to Longpants, Mom to Littlepants (9) and Tinypants (5). Love Camping in New England!

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            • #7
              Re: Family Tent Conundrum

              Go for it and get the outwell!!
              “One could not be a successful scientist without realizing that, in contrast to the popular conception supported by newspapers and mothers of scientists, a goodly number of scientists are not only narrow-minded and dull, but also just stupid.” - James D. Watson

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              • #8
                Re: Family Tent Conundrum

                Really, I tend towards the opposite end of the spectrum. Simpler is better, for me.
                2018: Any way the wind blows; doesn't really matter to me....Too Meee....

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